Let’s be honest: Everything that might be “worse” or “annoying” in Firefox for someone is not relevant in comparison to “no working adblocker available”. A browser without adblock is unusable
I haven’t actually found anything that doesn’t work on Firefox on my personal computer. At work we also use Firefox, and some things don’t work on it, but some things don’t work on chrome or edge either, it’s a hodge poge.
True, but if an adblocker no longer works on a specific browser, change your browser! I started using Netscape back in '94, and lost count on how many browsers I’ve tested and used in the past… Holy shit, 30+ years!!
It doesn’t sound right but it is. I think in ‘94 I was using Juno for email and internet. Shortly after that it was time to actually use one of the many AOL trial discs for service instead of a mini frisbee/ninja star.
Modem sounds, chat rooms, you’ve got mail. What a time to live!
Fuck. I got free internet for almost 5 years. So many AOL discs. 01, 02? Friend’s dad had a T1 connection put into their house for his work. The difference between T1 and the 56k I had at home? At home walk out the room, have a smoke, maybe ⅔ a boob loaded. At buddy’s house, that’s when I realised that the internet had the potential to change everything. Whole boob before you could even stand up.
Kids these days. No appreciation for how much struggle it used to be. Everything just. Just there. No bork the only computer in the house because boob.exe.
In the past 10 years it’s pretty much just been Firefox, Safari, Explorer/Edge, and Chrome. 99% of browsers are just skinned Chrome. Even Edge now. Opera’s engine died in 2013.
That’s also hugely in part because Apple develops Webkit at a snails pace. Some say they gimp their own rendring engine so that it isn’t competitive with native applications from the App Store. This way, there’s less incentive for developers to make web-apps to avoid the 30% app store tax.
Man I haven’t been around that long but I feel like some of my knowledge is outdated and I have to start with “a long time ago in a galaxy far far away” because I stopped paying attention
Mainly that Google intentionally makes its sites (like YouTube or Google Docs) slower and less useable when they detect you’re using Firefox, and/or ad blockers (which you need Firefox to use, so same difference).
It’s mostly fixable with add-ons and userscripts (and eventually, one hopes, with an antitrust lawsuit), but it’s still a hassle.
As for how to fix it, Mozilla tend to do a pretty good job of eventually working around Google’s bullshit, so keeping the browser updated is a good first step.
Since Google tends to roll this stuff out regionally and doing A/B testing, though, the best way is to identify what specific handicap they’re hassling you with (which specific features don’t work or don’t work right, when they work properly on chrome), and look for an updated add on or userscript to fix that particular issue.
Or you can just look for a generic YouTube or Google Docs “enhancer” add on and hope it fixes the issue without making the whole user experience too different from what you’re used to.
At one particular point it was, if I recall correctly, though Chrome also (mis)implements some standards its own way, so Google might also use that as a form of attack against anyone who implements them properly, much like Microsoft did in the bad old IE6 days…
It’s all a silly arms race, though, with Google coming up with new ways to enshittify the web for anyone not using Chrome or using ad blockers and Mozilla and ad blocker (and alternative YouTube frontend) developers trying to figure out what they broke this time and how to fix it, so what worked yesterday might not work today and work again tomorrow.
It’s all a profoundly stupid waste of everyone’s time and resources (all for a few more ad views) which will hopefully end up with Google losing their monopoly position on the web like the Internet Explorer bullshit did for Microsoft, but will keep being a major hassle for everyone until it does.
I very much dislike Mozilla’s direction over the last decade. They’re introducing user-hostile features that subtly break normal browsing experience, even when disabled[0]. Not like Google is better, but I’m also trying to get away from Mozilla.
[0] On Firefox Mobile, there’s a “feature” which makes the address bar auto-complete domains of companies paying Mozilla. I noticed this with Netflix - I never visit, but when I start writing a URL with n, roughly every 10th time Netflix was suggested. You can disable this feature, but this doesn’t actually disable it. The address bar no longer auto-completes with Netflix, instead it just doesn’t autocomplete! So 9/10 times I can write n and press Enter, but 1/10 times I press n and search for the letter n.
Mozilla doesn’t care whether they break features, as long as they can make more money. I strongly dislike this approach by the supposedly “good” browser manufacturer.
Do you have a good non chromium based alternative? To be clear I genuinely am asking those things make switching probably worth it considering how little of a hassle it is.
No, it’s still 100% owned and 100% controlled by Google.
The Linux Foundation is just making it easier for people outside of Google to submit work to it.
Cynically, you could say that Google is just trying to get free contributions while retaining all the control. Optimistically you could say this is the first step in Google giving up control of Chromium in the far future, although currently they’ve given zero verbal or written indicators that they plan to do that.
I still use the full screen tab groups feature that they removed from the core. I don’t like scrolling tabs, so I can just hit a button and click on the exact tab I want. I do probably have too many tabs open tbh.
I have no idea either. Sure, chrome is a little faster but its a minor difference in my opinion. Been using it for a long time and have no idea why it’s so unpopular.
Also, keep in mind, google has been caught slowing Firefox down in YouTube before. So if you notice any slowness in their services, it’s fair to suspect it might not be Firefox’s fault.
I advocate Firefox, but I must admit I personally am affected by regular crashes on Firefox desktop. Mostly when I enter a page I haven’t visited before (randomly though).
I don’t know if others are affected by this, and I still recommend Firefox regardless, but every crash leaves a sour taste in my mouth. As it is not widespread, it might just be my setup, but still.
Thats really weird. I have never personally had the issue but it is more and fair enough to have issues with FF after that. I would recommend brave then, still chromium based but is actively doing things to make sure their adblock still works.
I dont have issues with FF in general which would cause me to stop using it, while it is frustrating, not using something chromium based still outweighs that heavily. Its kinda of a matter of principle to me.
E: clarification
If you’re still using Chrome, do yourself a favour and install Firefox.
Let’s be honest: Everything that might be “worse” or “annoying” in Firefox for someone is not relevant in comparison to “no working adblocker available”. A browser without adblock is unusable
What a silly comment. Chrome has plenty of good ad blockers still.
“Is this water warming up, or is it just me? Nah, there’s a cool spot over here, this is fine.”
-Chrome users
Yeah, because Manifest v3 is just being rolled out as described in the article.
I haven’t actually found anything that doesn’t work on Firefox on my personal computer. At work we also use Firefox, and some things don’t work on it, but some things don’t work on chrome or edge either, it’s a hodge poge.
True, but if an adblocker no longer works on a specific browser, change your browser! I started using Netscape back in '94, and lost count on how many browsers I’ve tested and used in the past… Holy shit, 30+ years!!
Mosaic was awesome. Netscape 1 was pretty cool, but Netscape 2 and animated gifs… zowie! That was a day to remember.
…fuck off, '94 wasn’t 30… counts on fingers several times
…Shit…
I know… Jurassic Park is 33 years this year. It would be like watching a movie from the 60’ when it was released.
We’re old, friend.
I’ve never hated my life more than right now…
It doesn’t sound right but it is. I think in ‘94 I was using Juno for email and internet. Shortly after that it was time to actually use one of the many AOL trial discs for service instead of a mini frisbee/ninja star.
Modem sounds, chat rooms, you’ve got mail. What a time to live!
Fuck. I got free internet for almost 5 years. So many AOL discs. 01, 02? Friend’s dad had a T1 connection put into their house for his work. The difference between T1 and the 56k I had at home? At home walk out the room, have a smoke, maybe ⅔ a boob loaded. At buddy’s house, that’s when I realised that the internet had the potential to change everything. Whole boob before you could even stand up.
Kids these days. No appreciation for how much struggle it used to be. Everything just. Just there. No bork the only computer in the house because boob.exe.
In the past 10 years it’s pretty much just been Firefox, Safari, Explorer/Edge, and Chrome. 99% of browsers are just skinned Chrome. Even Edge now. Opera’s engine died in 2013.
Yup. Hence, the reason I originally suggested to use Firefox, only because it’s not built on Chromium.
Just FYI, the word “hence” literally means “for this reason”. So you just said “for this reason the reason” lol.
Chill dude, I’m just going to the ATM machine to put in my PIN number to take out some money. 🤙
Chrome uses WebKit, safaris engine.
Chrome forked Webkit in 2012 to create Blink. It is reasonable to assume they have somewhat diverged since.
Ahhh TIL
They’re developed separately. It’s a hard fork so I consider them different.
That’s also hugely in part because Apple develops Webkit at a snails pace. Some say they gimp their own rendring engine so that it isn’t competitive with native applications from the App Store. This way, there’s less incentive for developers to make web-apps to avoid the 30% app store tax.
Man I haven’t been around that long but I feel like some of my knowledge is outdated and I have to start with “a long time ago in a galaxy far far away” because I stopped paying attention
I use Palemoon for the nostalgia but also because of the best theme around, Moonscape
Netscape will forever be my number one.
What issues do people even have with firefox? Its a browser, it seems fast enough. Isn’t that all most people need from a browser
Mainly that Google intentionally makes its sites (like YouTube or Google Docs) slower and less useable when they detect you’re using Firefox, and/or ad blockers (which you need Firefox to use, so same difference).
It’s mostly fixable with add-ons and userscripts (and eventually, one hopes, with an antitrust lawsuit), but it’s still a hassle.
Unfortunately, with the FTC rolling back net neutrality protections, I don’t see an antitrust lawsuit happening, or succeeding, anytime soon
how do I find out more about this and what scripts do I need to make the sites faster again on Firefox
https://www.tomshardware.com/news/youtube-responds-to-delayed-loading-in-rival-browser-complaints, for instance.
Or https://www.zdnet.com/article/former-mozilla-exec-google-has-sabotaged-firefox-for-years/, for an older one.
As for how to fix it, Mozilla tend to do a pretty good job of eventually working around Google’s bullshit, so keeping the browser updated is a good first step.
Since Google tends to roll this stuff out regionally and doing A/B testing, though, the best way is to identify what specific handicap they’re hassling you with (which specific features don’t work or don’t work right, when they work properly on chrome), and look for an updated add on or userscript to fix that particular issue.
Or you can just look for a generic YouTube or Google Docs “enhancer” add on and hope it fixes the issue without making the whole user experience too different from what you’re used to.
thanks. I keep Firefox updated. the fact that changing the user agent gets the delay is pretty damning evidence
Would you happen to know whether this is something that a UserAgent spoofer would suffice to get around?
At one particular point it was, if I recall correctly, though Chrome also (mis)implements some standards its own way, so Google might also use that as a form of attack against anyone who implements them properly, much like Microsoft did in the bad old IE6 days…
It’s all a silly arms race, though, with Google coming up with new ways to enshittify the web for anyone not using Chrome or using ad blockers and Mozilla and ad blocker (and alternative YouTube frontend) developers trying to figure out what they broke this time and how to fix it, so what worked yesterday might not work today and work again tomorrow.
It’s all a profoundly stupid waste of everyone’s time and resources (all for a few more ad views) which will hopefully end up with Google losing their monopoly position on the web like the Internet Explorer bullshit did for Microsoft, but will keep being a major hassle for everyone until it does.
I very much dislike Mozilla’s direction over the last decade. They’re introducing user-hostile features that subtly break normal browsing experience, even when disabled[0]. Not like Google is better, but I’m also trying to get away from Mozilla.
[0] On Firefox Mobile, there’s a “feature” which makes the address bar auto-complete domains of companies paying Mozilla. I noticed this with Netflix - I never visit, but when I start writing a URL with n, roughly every 10th time Netflix was suggested. You can disable this feature, but this doesn’t actually disable it. The address bar no longer auto-completes with Netflix, instead it just doesn’t autocomplete! So 9/10 times I can write n and press Enter, but 1/10 times I press n and search for the letter n.
Mozilla doesn’t care whether they break features, as long as they can make more money. I strongly dislike this approach by the supposedly “good” browser manufacturer.
Do you have a good non chromium based alternative? To be clear I genuinely am asking those things make switching probably worth it considering how little of a hassle it is.
Sadly not, I’d also be interested in one!
isn’t chromium under the Linux foundation now? Might look at the options on that side.
No, it’s still 100% owned and 100% controlled by Google.
The Linux Foundation is just making it easier for people outside of Google to submit work to it.
Cynically, you could say that Google is just trying to get free contributions while retaining all the control. Optimistically you could say this is the first step in Google giving up control of Chromium in the far future, although currently they’ve given zero verbal or written indicators that they plan to do that.
damn that sucks.
GNOME Web if on Linux
This comment made me look into if KDE has one and apparently they do it even has built in ad blocking.
Off to compile for 3 hours. /j
Makes me remember when I used Konqueror with FF as a fallback before Chrome existed.
Download fennec it’s the fork of ff mobile with less of the cruft.
I don’t know if it has fixed that specific problem, but I can’t recall seeing it
Thanks for the recommendation, I’ll give it a try!
See also Mull, No 120hz though.
Mull was part of the DIvestOS project, which has recently been discontinued.
For a similarly strengthened fork, I’ve been using IronFox after seeing it recommended on Lemmy.
Also, I don’t think one can export bookmarks from Android Firefox either.
No horizontal tab grouping. Tab groups on Chrome are perfect, and the Firefox tab extensions all suck in comparison.
That said, I’m still using Firefox today because the internet is unusable without a good ad blocker.
Tab groups and vertical tabs are at least on Nightly now; you can enable them in settings.
I still use the full screen tab groups feature that they removed from the core. I don’t like scrolling tabs, so I can just hit a button and click on the exact tab I want. I do probably have too many tabs open tbh.
Some js is a bit slower. I typically use chrome for self hosted apps, jupyter etc.
I think wasm performance is actually better in Firefox though.
I have no idea either. Sure, chrome is a little faster but its a minor difference in my opinion. Been using it for a long time and have no idea why it’s so unpopular.
Also, keep in mind, google has been caught slowing Firefox down in YouTube before. So if you notice any slowness in their services, it’s fair to suspect it might not be Firefox’s fault.
No way it stays that way after blocking ad-blocking. Some websites genuinely take over 30s without ad block.
I advocate Firefox, but I must admit I personally am affected by regular crashes on Firefox desktop. Mostly when I enter a page I haven’t visited before (randomly though).
I don’t know if others are affected by this, and I still recommend Firefox regardless, but every crash leaves a sour taste in my mouth. As it is not widespread, it might just be my setup, but still.
If you have the time try the troubleshoot mode to help figure it out - add ons are often the cause
https://support.mozilla.org/en-US/kb/troubleshoot-firefox-crashes-closing-or-quitting
Thats really weird. I have never personally had the issue but it is more and fair enough to have issues with FF after that. I would recommend brave then, still chromium based but is actively doing things to make sure their adblock still works.
I dont have issues with FF in general which would cause me to stop using it, while it is frustrating, not using something chromium based still outweighs that heavily. Its kinda of a matter of principle to me. E: clarification
In Australia it won’t save card details. And it can’t natively create app shortcuts for things like Gmail, keep, whatsapp etc.
I put up with it but it’s a pain compared to chrome and edge.