Because it’s profitable.
For the same reason we have every fucking other problem in the world right now.
Capitalism.
You cannot align incentives towards growing the wealth of a microscopic yet astronomically lecherous group of monsters and expect society to not just crumble under the weight.
This is most prevalent on androids, even stock pixel. As much as I like to shit on apple, they have less bloat on your phone. Of course whatever native app you have on there, you wouldn’t able to delete, whereas on android you could delete it if you really wanted to.
Basically, because we don’t own our devices. We are allowed to use our devices by the good graces of the manufacturers that charge a premium for them.
This really needs to change. I remember the preinstalled app antitrust suit(s) in the early 00s. Those need to happen again, but likely the EU will have to as the US is entering a dark age, and the US will continue to have inferior everything to the rest of the world for the foreseeable future.
We’re not. It’s 2024.
You mean it’ll all magically go *POOF!* come the new year?!? I’ll wait until then to set up my new phone, then!
They are a prefect example of I’m a prviliged person who has not suffered so I refuse to believe that the current system causes suffering
Few people want to pay full price for their phone.
I mean, yeah, but there’s also manufacturer bloatware. This model year, Samsung in particular has outdone themselves with the implementation of their AI chatbot nearly zero percent of their customer base wanted.
Because people keep buying Xiaomi and Samsung shit that’s loaded with crap (at least over here, I understand this varies massively by region).
Base Android is also loaded with crap, directly from Google. Android is the worst mobile operating system, with the exception of all the others.
Base Android (AOSP) is not, what you probably mean is Google Android.
Look at GrapheneOS, that is a usable, privacy-focused Android without bloat.
Almost none of the devices are shipped with anything but Google’s Android, and manufacturers don’t provide you alternative versions of Android
Yes, Google owns Android as a whole, but (almost?) every single OEM customizes Android for their purposes. That is not the same thing.
It works on pixels only, I don’t trust Google hardware
I guess we just have a simple task - to make sure that all android phones are running base android.
How do u propose that could be done?Legislation to allow installing arbitrary OS and firmware on all consumer devices.
At least Samsung phones are only bloated with Samsung apps, which in most part you can uninstall or disable. Although it’s still fucking stupid that when you buy a new phone you need to do a lot of maintenance just to make your phone work as it should, and not slow down because of shitty apps.
My Samsung tablet had a lot of non Samsung apps, some even duplicating Samsung ones.
I disabled no less than 10, there are other 10 I can’t
I mind the Google crap more than I mind the Samsung stuff. At least Samsung’s browser supports ad blockers since ages. That Chrome POS is just useless.
i buy samsung cause parts aka easier to source parts.
fixing phones is the biggest scam ever. once you open the phone you are always going to have problems with the phone. they are not made to be opened and repaired.
As much as I hate this saying, it sounds like a skill issue
I’ve done repairs on all my phones. New buttons, screens, batteries, ports, etc. I’ve never caused an unforeseen new issue by doing so.
Its not so much a skill issue, more so phone repair stores are the scams. they break stuff that wasn’t broken in the first place and get you to come back with the that issue or say it was also broken. Source: used to work in the phone repair industry and knew people who did this on the regular and is a standard.
What you describe is literally a skill issue though, if they’re breaking unrelated components.
Depends on the model, and the manufacturers would certainly prefer you replaced it, but I’ve privately fixed a few phones for friends/family. Fucked up and broke the first one, but the ones after are pretty much all still running without issue.
you can argue that iphones and pixel phones etc… have bloatware/spyware/malware as well.
And laptops, desktops, televisions …
I have a pixel phone with GrapheneOS. My laptop and desktops run Linux. The TV I haven’t gotten to, but the options are there as well to have a high quality, yet dumb display.
- buy a laptop/desktop
- boot up windows and setup with fake shit
- download and flash your favourite linux distro
- disable secure boot
- boot from usb.
- ???
- profit!
Most mainline Linux distro work pretty seamlessly with secureboot these days.
Sadly, there are a few programs I can’t run on Linux but I use it daily, no windows
What programs?
I want to add here my deeply missed Playnite. There is nothing under Linux that comes close. I’ve settled for the combination of steam, heroic and lutris, but that is not even close for sure.
While I don’t know all the details, and as far as I know there has been no official statement that it will support Linux, the current rewrite of the codebase that is going on will at least allow much easier compatability with Linux. So there’s hope :)
- Internet Download Manager (IDM): Yee, I know it may not increase your download speed but was kinda good to have the main folder of downloads and every file by category downloaded in a subdirectories: Images, Documents, videos, etc. Using JDownloader 2 but it’s not the same
- Affinity Designer: I know there is “Inkscape” but I still prefer affinity for it’s UI and because I’m used to it
- AMD Adrenaline: Yeah, maybe was a bloatware and shit but kinda liked the built in record feature and tweaks you could do
fair enough, nobody is forcing you to switch, but Inkscape is there, and i am pretty sure there is a replacement program for on-the-fly recording (never looked into it, i don’t really play games like that)
I tried Xubuntu years ago because my PC was shit then kinda abandoned it, got tired of windows and installed Linux. After a big update, Linux broke and trying to reinstall it I… Picked the wrong partition and deleted windows lol
Inkscape is nice but in used to Affinity Designer and kinda love it. For Adrenaline I’m sure it exists but steam built-in feature is enough.
I love my Linux and fuck Micro$oft
ugh. wanted to get a oled tv but will not buy a smart tv.
Honestly … Just don’t connect the TV to the Internet.
ive been pretty anti consumerist lately so I don’t need much to get me to not buy things.
Just keep it offline and get yourself a Nvidia shield as a multimedia station. They are excellent.
yeah I really don’t want to have to but that is what I had to do with my fridge. keep it offline.
Same for my dishwasher. I don’t even understand why that thing asked for a wifi connection in the first place, it’s not like I can remotely unload it or anything. And a notification is perfectly useless when I can just check my watch…
heck I was mad years ago when my microwave wanted to know the year. this stuff is getting rediculous. I need to start a thing like the amish but no internet connections allowed except for computers and phones. well ok cameras and sensors.
Luckily most devices work perfectly fine without internet. And I get the convenience of being able to switch on the heating or lower the window blinds and stuff from the office before leaving so that it’s nice at home, but we did that back in the 90s with a simple timer.
most of the time a timer is more useful than remote access. I have been very tempted to pick up a clapper.
Facebook, Netflix and Spotify are bloatware.
It’s 2024 though?
Timezones bro
Yep, time zones. Some places are in 2025 already and the US is stuck in 1940.
i just want to be in the 80s/90s with a text terminal using lynx
you suggestij we win this fight within this month?
press X to doubt
If you’re still in 2024, you’re already behind. Get on with the times and start grinding. DM for a link to my weebinar and 5% discount on my eebook.
The problem is that most phones don’t support ROM’s like Graphene or Linage, as people installing custom roms is a relic of years past. Next time you get a phone, think about if you want this option for yourself. Also, do keep in mind that some phones have HW backdoors on them, so even installing a stock rom/graphene does not save you from privacy.
They made it very hard to install roms.
There is this orange warning on boot.
Then banking apps don’t work.
With a rooted phone you can install Zygisk (magisk + zygote) and then a bunch of modules that simulate system integrity.
What you need are “play integrity fix” and “playcurl_NEXT”.
The first module lets you bypass the google play integrity check, the second one will download updated integrity fingerprint files every 5 minutes to ensure that the bypass never fails.
If you know how to install custom ROMs, this part is not a big challenge.
Thank you. Yeah I was aware that there is magysk. Problem is - it’s becoming too many hacks to deal with. And I bet it probably breaks from time to time and one has to hack/fix it again?
With playcurl next I didn’t experience any issues yet, it’s polling a new device fingerprint every couple minutes to make sure your device never ends up on a blocklist, and you can trigger this manually in the magisk app as well.
Can’t guarantee it’s never going to be blocked if Google changes the algorithm, but that would just mean they have to adjust the fingerprinting as well.
HW backdoors
Tell me more!
And lil papa google now forces GPlay Integrity so custom Roms are fucked
Nah you can easily bypass play integrity on a rooted phone, see my comment above.
I’m using Grapheneos and rooting the room will make it less secure 🤷♂️ and I don’t see why root my phone
My primary use case was magisk to enable taking screenshots from otherwise protected apps. Was living in China for almost 7 years, and even though I speak it quite alright, reading is a whole other level. And there are quite a few apps there that I had to use on a regular basis that had this damned flag_secure enabled so I couldn’t otherwise take screenshots to run them through a translation app.
The second one was system level adblock, since the alternative is for adblockers to install themselves as local VPNs routing traffic to 127.0.0.1; however being in China meant I actually had to use a real VPN to access the free internet, and I certainly didn’t want to choose between ads or privacy. The latter still applies; I’m using a VPN on most days.
Lastly, being able to use magisk also gives me access to some advanced security apps such as Hibernator (freezes apps, meaning they are basically uninstalled and reactivated on press, so they can’t use data, don’t get updated etc.), Storage Isolation (lets you configure on a per-app basis which folders it might access), App Ops (advanced permission management, which also includes an ignore function that acts like as if a certain permission was granted, but would feed random data or zeros to the app).
Being able to uninstall everything including system apps is also nice, though that can still be achieved with adb. Browsing root folders when looking for specific data is also nice, but I used that twice in about 5 years, so it’s probably not essential.
I’m gonna look into getting Huawei os
Why Hauwei OS?
It’s android but without google . Given how much google fucks with me, I’m willing to say fuck u to google
Google fucks with everyone, now more than ever with this “recommended” (forced) play integrity. Look at the recent ban from Uber, Authy (thank god I switched a few days ago) and some other apps
I was curious why Hauwei and not LineageOS, GrapheneOS, Calyx, etc
tbh recently I just don’t have time to futs with roms.
Ive used lineage for many years. And would love to use it permanently but banking apps is a problem for me and having to hack things too much is a problem for me.
Obviously some linux mobile distro would have been ideal. but There isn’t anything usable.calyx/graphene - the model selection is just too limited. And I would never buy a google or apple device.
lineage os doesn’t support oneplus 12R I use now (well there is unofficial rom).so I would like to try huawei, the hope is - it’s like android but naturally without google because its designed like that.
Well its known that SoC’s have backdoors on them. Usually it calls home to China, so you can guess what that’s for.
Honestly I don’t really give a shit if China invades my privacy I have nothing they’d care about anyway. I just don’t want American corporations doing it to try to sell me more shit.
With u on this sentiment
I do. fuck china.
Fuck em sure. But they can’t reach me , us corporations that block US gdpr legislation year after year - they want to use my data and fuck me over
fuck the CIA and fuck PRISIM
So phone like Xiaomi? Sorry, I’m kinda dumb in this
Xiaomi is the biggest offender, but all of them do it.
Fair. Didn’t know that
why do you think richard stallman doesn’t use a smartphone?
That’s true. Graphene is majorly Pixel limited, I guess. And even Lineage has a small set of devices when one considers the nos of OEMs and variants they manufacture per year.
Even pixel or Fairphone is fairly free of bloatware compared to Samsung and shitty Chinese brands as long as you are not privacy paranoid about Google services.
I am privacy paranoid.
And that’s fine, but first people like you (and me to some extent) are in the vast minority and that’s also not an issue of bloatware per se.
yeah the only problem is that i have to participate in this hellhole capitalist society. Im trying to figure out what the best VPN is to use, along side if tor is worth using.
'Cos capitalism.
Only on Android and Windows.
Zero issues on Linux and MacOS
iOS doesn’t come with any preinstalled Apple bloatware either. Oh, wait.
It’s hardly intrusive, no pop ups or “hey I’m here” notifications. You can uninstall most of them in seconds without special tools.
Android crapware is much more deeper, it’s not stuff your grandma can uninstall.
Can you uninstall Apple TV, Apple Music, Books, FaceTime, Fitness/Health, Podcasts, and News?
Can you disable Safari or the App Store?
Can you install non–Apple-sanctioned apps?
Which isn’t to say Android’s situation is great for various manufacturers, just weird to not include iOS.
Yes for all of the first group.
No for Safari.
My need to install “unsanctioned” apps on my phone is on par with my need to install random apps on my PS5. Zero. YMMV.
Open source android apps has entered the hallway, I’m sorry but the amount of cool, open-source privacy respecting apps on android is MAGNITUDES higher than IOS, I wouldn’t like having a locked down phone on my hand, it’s painful. My need to use “unsanctioned” apps is on par with wanting to eat fruits after cutting them in even pieces instead of biting on the whole. It’s a strong preference thing because I would not like having to eat whole apples(for example) EVERY TIME I eat.
Android crapware is much more deeper, it’s not stuff your grandma can uninstall.
…
installs custom rom
not every person can-
Their problem.
It’s hardly intrusive, no pop ups or “hey I’m here” notifications. You can uninstall most of them in seconds without special tools.
If that’s your definition of bloatware then this point:
Android crapware is much more deeper, it’s not stuff your grandma can uninstall.
Is pretty silly as Android has less apps built into the OS, and I can actually go into settings and disable them very easily. Specific phone carriers might add bullshit on top of that, but that’s not Android doing that
Android is giving the carriers the option to do that. They don’t need to give the tools for crapware installation
Implying that we should not give anyone any freedom just because it can be abused, Developers can make better and more privacy respecting OS than vanilla android and we should just flush all that drown the drain and instead shove everything vanilla into everyone’s ass. GREAAAT!
Wait a second, iOS is chock full of garbage that you can’t uninstall whatsoever. At least on Android you have a chance to get rid of everything.
With the exception of Safari, you can uninstall every application using the standard process.
Can you do that for Android carrier crapware that’s preinstalled? Just tap on it and choose uninstall?
I never buy phones from carriers, always directly from manufacturers, so no idea. Manufacturer bloat can be deleted pretty straightforward.
You do understand that you’re not in the majority?
The root problem is that Android lets carriers “enhance” their devices with crapware and also make it hard or impossible to install without technical know-how
I don’t know anybody buying those crappy carrier deals, to be honest. They had a place and time in the early 2000s, but beyond that they seemed to die out mostly. Maybe still a thing in the US, no idea.
While also, making device cheaper, if I can get the same device with the same specs with a diffrence of 100usd with extra bloatware(plus bootloader unlocking capabilities), you know what I’m buying
Because it’s profitable to include.
Why would companies care as much about the minor brand value decrease in the eyes of more technical users when they can make more money right now by making things shittier?
