- cross-posted to:
- crumbgrabber@lemm.ee
- cross-posted to:
- crumbgrabber@lemm.ee
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I still cannot believe NASA managed to re-establish a connection with Voyager 1.
That scene from The Martian where JPL had a hardware copy of Pathfinder on Earth? That’s not apocryphal. NASA keeps a lot of engineering models around for a variety of purposes including this sort of hardware troubleshooting.
It’s a practice they started after Voyager. They shot that patch off into space based off of old documentation, blueprints, and internal memos.
I realize the Voyager project may not be super well funded today (how is it funded, just general NASA funds now?), just wondering what they have hardware-wise (or ever had). Certainly the Voyager system had to have precursors (versions)?
Or do they have a simulator of it today - we’re talking about early 70’s hardware, should be fairly straightforward to replicate in software? Perhaps some independent geeks have done this for fun? (I’ve read of some old hardware such as 8088 being replicated in software because some geeks just like doing things like that).
I have no idea how NASA functions with old projects like this, and I’m surely not saying I have better ideas - they’ve probably thought of a million more ways to validate what they’re doing.
Probably brought in some of the original guys for one last job.
takes long drag off cigarette “I’m too old for this shit”
You sure? The smell off some of the corpses will have been terrible.
I’m not saying they’re all dead, but an intern at the time of launch would now be 70. Anybody who actually designed anything is… Well… The odds of them still being around are low.
I have a uncle who worked on Apollo writing machine code, and he is a spry, clear-headed 80-something-year-old.
IIRC, they did pull in a guy who had just started his career on the project.
Son of a bitch, I’m in.
do I hear heist movie?
The Hard Fork podcast had a pretty good episode recently where they interviewed one of the engineers on the project. They’d troubleshooted the spacecraft enough in the past that they weren’t starting from square one, but it still sounded pretty difficult.
They apparently didn’t have an emulator. The first thing I’d have done when working on a solution would have been to build one, but they seem to have pulled it off without.
There is an fascinating documentary about the team that sends the commands to Voyager 1 and 2 called It’s Quieter in the Twilight
100% they’ve got an emulator, they’ve had dedicated test environments since the moon landing for emulating disaster recovery scenarios since the moon landings, they’ve likely got at least one functioning hardware replica and very likely can spin up a hardware emulation as a virtual machine at will.
Source: I made this up, but I have a good understanding of systems admin and have a interest in space stuff so I’m pretty confident they would have this stuff at bare minimum
That’s my assumption too, but we’re talking about a different era, and I really have no idea how they approached validation and test/troubleshooting.
I’ve seen some test environments for manned missions, but that’s really for humans to validate what they’re doing.
V’ger was quick 'n dirty by comparison (with no criticism of the process or folks involved…they had one chance to get these missions out there).
Still faster than the average Windows update.
Microsoft can’t even release a fix for Window’s recovery partition being too small to stage updates. I had to do it myself, fucking amateurs.
Can’t or won’t? The same issue exists for both windows 10 and 11, but they haven’t closed the ticket for windows 11… Typical bullshit. It’s not exactly planned obsolescence, but when a bug comes up like that they’re just gonna grab the opportunity to go “sry impossible, plz buy new products”
I didn’t know that. So the ticket is still open for 11 but there’s still no fix?
That is my understanding.
I can’t find the article that I read just yesterday, but this is somewhat the same story: https://www.theregister.com/2024/05/03/microsoft_windows_recovery_environment/
NASA should be in charge of Windows updates!
Certainly better tested.
Well, they only had to test it for a single hardware deployment. Windows has to be tested for millions if not billions of deployments. Say what you want, but Microsoft testers are god like.
More stable, too.
Absolutely. The computers on Voyager hold the record for being the longest continuously running computer of all time.
Interviewer: Tell me an interesting debugging story
Interviewee: …
Heh. Years ago during an interview I was explaining how important it is to verify a system before putting it into orbit. If one found problems in orbit, you usually can’t fix it. My interviewer said, “Why not just send up the space shuttle to fix it?”
Well…
I think the term “metal” is overused, but this is probably the most metal thing a programmer could possibly do besides join a metal band.
Keep in mind too these guys are writing and reading in like assembly or some precursor to it.
I can only imagine the number of checks and rechecks they probably go through before they press the “send” button. Especially now.
This is nothing like my loosey goosey programming where I just hit compile or download and just wait to see if my change works the way I expect…
I wont even upgrade the BIOS on my motherboard because im afraid of bricking it.
As a teenager I experienced a power outage while I was updating my bios.
Guess what happened?
I’m still bitter about it.
You can negate that risk by getting a UPS. You should get a UPS in any case imo since even a shitty one lets you at least save your work and shutdown properly if your electricity drops.
Oh yeah, I learned that lesson.
I got a big mean one these days.
I updated mine a couple of weeks ago. I was actually really anxious as It went through the process, but it worked fine, at first…
Then I found out Microsoft considered it a new computer and deactivated windows. (And that’s when I found out they deleted upgrade licences from windows 7 & 8 back in September)That’s Microsoft in a nutshell for ya.
Buy spare flash chip
Rejected : please comment your changes
Great documentary on the Voyager team: It’s quieter in the twilight
I prefer the sequel Star Trek: the motion picture.
V’ger 2: 2patch2furious
Bu… but there… there already was a Star Trek Voyager?
Why do Tumblr users approach every topic like a manic street preacher?
There’s a significant overlap between theatre kids and Tumblr users.
When I hear what they did, I was blown away. A 50 year old computer (that was probably designed a decade before launching) and the geniuses that built that put in the facility to completely reprogram it a light-day away.
OTS flashing.
Like OTA but with space rather than air.
OTV (void)
I wonder how it is secured, or could anyone with a big enough transmitter reprogram it at will…
Modern satellites are protected by various means of encryption, but there’s an enthusiast community that tracks down and communicates with very old unencrypted zombie satellites. There’s even been an NGO which managed to fire rockets on an abandoned NASA/ESA probe (with their approval.)
The Voyagers benefits primarily from the lack of groups with an adequate deep space network to communicate with it. Their communication standards are otherwise completely open and well documented.
“Yeah, I always leave my car unlocked with the keys inside. I also always park it in the center of a lake.”
More like, below the lake.
Thanks for that link, cool stuff!
You may be interested in learning about its downlink: https://destevez.net/2021/09/decoding-voyager-1/
I just have to imagine how interesting of a challenege that is. Kinda like when old games only had 300kb to store all their data on so you had to program cool tricks to get it all to work.
No yeah, it’s like that plus the thing is a light day away, and on top of that malfunctioning on a hardware level. Incredible
It reminds me that there are still very intelligent and talented people within our ranks. A nice breath of fresh air.
**This also means that aliens can reprogram all of our satellites. **
Yes if they can track them in middle of space.
It’s impressive that we can still send data to the satellite. I mean you need to send the signal to the place where the satellite will be in 24 hours.
Nearly all such satellites would have highly directional antennas, so the aliens would have to be neat earth before they could do that. Voyager is not expecting a command signal from anywhere else but Earth. The signal would have to originate not more than a fraction of a degree from Earth from Voyager’s perspective.
So they just need to go behind it?
