Dutch has a formal and informal 2nd person word (think “you” vs “thou”).
I have an intern who will not stop using the formal version, and it feels super awkward. I keep telling her to stop it, but she said she always uses with older people…
Fun fact about English, “you” was actually the more formal one. But since we don’t use “thou” anymore, and most people know it from old-timey speak and church, we think of it as more formal today.
Fun fact about Dutch: The informal is ‘jou/je’ and de formal is ‘u’, the last one, however, is pronounced like English ‘you’, the former is pronounced like old-time-english thou.
Do you mean je vs u? Could you tell me more about which would be appopriate in settings like a police control, a shop or a campsite? I’m learning dutch but still trying to grasp those things :)
Welcome to dutch, where there are more exceptions than rules, and the natives just ignore the rules anyway!
In general, “Je” is by far the most common form. Children use “u” with adult strangers, adults are generally only expected to use it with people in authority positions, but that’s becoming more and more rare. It’s still polite to use “u” with strangers, but nobody will be very upset if you don’t, unless you’re addressing a judge, mayor or your boss’s boss.
Some people address their grandparents formally, but most don’t. It’s still considered polite to use it with much older people, like 30+ years older, but hardly will be upset if you don’t.
Quite a few companies require customer-facing jobs always use “u”, to be respectful, but even that is getting less. My city sends me letters with “jij” nowadays.
That advice could also be harmful to your career. Being subservient like that will make sure that your boss will never see you as an equal as e.g. a potential successor
sir doesn’t sit well with me either for work positions, I say it to be nice sometimes, but not because you’re my boss. and if someone calls me sir, my response is " I’m not your sir, just call me …"
My grandpa told me “always call your boss sir, and respond “yes sir”, youll be promoted real quick.”
First day at my first job my boss tells me “by the way you don’t need to call me sir, just Brian”
Its actually insane that the world that boomers lived in was that simple.
Dutch has a formal and informal 2nd person word (think “you” vs “thou”).
I have an intern who will not stop using the formal version, and it feels super awkward. I keep telling her to stop it, but she said she always uses with older people…
She’s 23, I’m mid 30s. Ouch.
At least she doesn’t help you cross the street. Yet.
“Is your lunch soft enough? Should I cut it up for you? We have a blender back in the kitchen if you want?”
Fun fact about English, “you” was actually the more formal one. But since we don’t use “thou” anymore, and most people know it from old-timey speak and church, we think of it as more formal today.
Well, people in the past talked MUCH more formally than we do.
If I talked to my grandfather in 1400 the way I talk to my husband today, he’d probably disown me.
Fun fact about Dutch: The informal is ‘jou/je’ and de formal is ‘u’, the last one, however, is pronounced like English ‘you’, the former is pronounced like old-time-english thou.
You do those shenanigans in french too.
Super complicated with SO family though uhg.
Do you mean je vs u? Could you tell me more about which would be appopriate in settings like a police control, a shop or a campsite? I’m learning dutch but still trying to grasp those things :)
Welcome to dutch, where there are more exceptions than rules, and the natives just ignore the rules anyway!
In general, “Je” is by far the most common form. Children use “u” with adult strangers, adults are generally only expected to use it with people in authority positions, but that’s becoming more and more rare. It’s still polite to use “u” with strangers, but nobody will be very upset if you don’t, unless you’re addressing a judge, mayor or your boss’s boss.
Some people address their grandparents formally, but most don’t. It’s still considered polite to use it with much older people, like 30+ years older, but hardly will be upset if you don’t.
Quite a few companies require customer-facing jobs always use “u”, to be respectful, but even that is getting less. My city sends me letters with “jij” nowadays.
sounds kind of like je vs vous in french, not quite the same but used in a similar way
Funny thing, we actually call the calling someone jij tutoyeren and calling someone u vousvoyeren. This comes from the French.
Thank you, that’s definitely good to know!
“You need to keep phoning and sending letters to employers, they’ll give you a job eventually”.
Lump that in with the ‘apply in person’ crowd too.
Just walk in with your resume and and ask to see the manager so you can shake their hand…
Sir Brian of Work
That advice could also be harmful to your career. Being subservient like that will make sure that your boss will never see you as an equal as e.g. a potential successor
They didn’t. Some Boomers are also in the “just Brian” camp.
sir doesn’t sit well with me either for work positions, I say it to be nice sometimes, but not because you’re my boss. and if someone calls me sir, my response is " I’m not your sir, just call me …"
Maybe?
That’s how I see it too. It’s like a whimsical anachronism referencing a more formal era.
Al?
If you’ll be my bodyguard, I can be your long lost pal!